Puffwagon
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Posts posted by Puffwagon
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Yeah man, I would. The car is already tuned, you just have to adjust the fuel and timing to suit your engine specs and boost level.
Not sure if you have some but a set of knock ears is mandatory for tuning ignition timing on a barra when you're learning to tune. It takes stuff all to break a ring land and it's cheaper to buy knock ears than another engine these days.
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Put auF0220 back to stock. This table should not be zero'd out. Old literature suggested halving it but imo that is still not a good idea and doesn't work very well unless on E85.
The way that tune file is set up isn't how you should go about tuning. It will be doughy to drive and have no top end pull.
Leave the MBT map stock, leave all of the corrections stock, then you modify the BLK map to suit the timing curve that it outputs.
If you are worried about detonation, get a set of knock ears for starters, when you start to tune it you should remove 4 degrees from the whole BLK map and start with a low boost setting, eg: 5psi.
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I tried a SAAS 140psi oil pressure sensor for E85 in the FRP the other day and it worked.
In regard to needing a sensor over 100psi, my oil pump has a relief spring that is rated from 110psi to 160psi. I also run 40psi or more boost pressure with 60psi base fuel pressure. I would prefer to have a fail-safe that works up to 150psi for those reasons.
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2 hours ago, 2X044 said:
has anyone ever used an oil pressure sensor to measure fuel pressure?
Nope but I have one here and was waiting for a reason to try it out.
One thing I saw in the logs is that the oil temp is only around 20C. I'm not sure if it will change anything when this value is higher but it would be worth checking.
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No worries, I'm happy to help where I can. This endeavour could result in something that could be a vital add on for the stock pcm and could save engines in some cases. I'm all about it.
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What happens if you start the run at 2000rpm? Mine would start with the throttle partially closed and only go to WOT after 3500 or so. Could be a completely different issue, especially since you're looking at a BTR.
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This is in my tune
auF2184 Maximum allowable input torque is 1200
auF1741 Maximum Input Shaft Torque before stall torque truncation is used (In forward gears) is 750
auF1795 Maximum Input Shaft Torque before torque truncation is used is 1200
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Yes, if you can limit the engine's ability to rev up then that will give the user time to react.
There are 2 types of users to think about, the "I put petrol in and it goes vroom" type that can't catch a preventable failure and the others that are alert and aware enough to react to a torque reduction event. Hopefully we can accommodate both but we can only do what we can do.
Torque reduction for fuel safety would work as long as all the injectors were 100% switched off for long enough for the engine to drop boost pressure. You wouldn't want a partial cut as it'll still have 3 cylinders firing and they can still be damaged by running lean.
We have torque reduction during a gearshift in an auto car, mostly it's done by reducing ignition timing. Perhaps this can be used for something.
Rate of change for oil pressure below a certain threshold should work fine.
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I changed the maximum input shaft torque to 1200, dunno if that's what fixed it
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I used to see my car do that in 3rd gear only (zf6), it was a form of trans truncation.
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I'll have to reply tomorrow, ran out of time today.
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How's it going @2X044?
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It's probably the best place for it tbh
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Whaddaya mean? My Toshiba Satellite L300 can run at least 6 channels @ 1 update per second 🙃
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Moved both cams 1 tooth and the cam timing looks the same as a previous high power dyno run. It also has stuff all cam error at wot now.
Worth a mention, the cam timing was installed correctly with the various marks etc. Both cams are visibly on the retarded side now but the car seems happy with it.
Will see how the graph looks on Thursday after a dyno run, I won't be convinced everything is working right until after the dyno.
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You have to turn the engine off with complete oil pressure loss. I recent had an oil pump body shatter and the engine kept running at wot, over 600awkw at that particular time, until it seized a cam in the head, snapped the timing chain, bent all the valves and damaged the cam and cam journals. A very expensive exercise lol. A complete engine shutdown would have at least prevented the head and valve damage.
With low fuel pressure you don't need an engine shutdown.
Lots of people run more than one fuel pump. Losing a pump will create the low fuel pressure scenario that puts an engine in danger and the best way to save the engine is to close the throttle.
While there may be more than one way to achieve those ends, there are definite things that need to happen to prevent engine damage.
If the CHT fmem can take care of everything that's great, at any rate I was just adding ideas to the pile 😃
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Hey just a thought, instead of having the pcm do all of the work, what if we used the ancillary box to trigger a relay that would turn the ignition off? This would work for a zero oil pressure situation.
Sending an overboost signal to the pcm triggers an injector cut, that would be suitable for low oil pressure.
I've dealt with a territory that had a throttle closing issue and it turned out to be some pins not connecting in the main harness. Due to the way the throttle body is managed, you could either send a failed throttle body signal to the pcm for a lean out or as per the first paragraph, use the ancillary box to trigger a relay that disconnects the throttle body, hence closing it.
Anyhow there's something, maybe you've already thought about all of it, maybe not 🙃
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Hey if we end up with something that can act like an aftermarket ecu in terms of failsafes, we're one step closer to not needed to go aftermarket.
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Slight follow up, the intake cam seems to be 11 degrees advanced according to some logs that I've compared. I'm pretty sure that was the number I measured when I assembled the engine with locked VCT. I'll see if I can get it to run the extra cam retard it needs up top with the VCT angle table when I get a chance. Haha otherwise it looks like I might have to use the offset parameter mentioned earlier and do the SD map from scratch....again
Edit: I added 10 degrees to the cam timing table and the timing still stayed where it was. It is showing the intake cam error that matches what the table is asking for.
Edit edit: There's 42 teeth per phaser which works out to be about 8.5 degrees per tooth. I'm gonna move both cams one tooth and see what happens.
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In the case of a complete loss of oil pressure you want an immediate engine shutdown and also a failure to restart. Immediate shutdown is the only suitable way of dealing with a complete oil pressure loss. In the case of oil pressure going low ie 10 psi, a complete throttle shut with the inability to reopen the throttle until the ignition is cycled is suitable.
For fuel related things, the only thing we are concerned about is the engine leaning out. A complete loss of fuel pressure solves itself, the engine shuts down, however should be addressed. A partial loss of fuel pressure is where things get dangerous and a suitable fail-safe for this is to close the throttle. An issue I see here is losing the FPR reference line and still having 60psi of fuel pressure, when you should have 100psi. When you return to cruising, the fuel pressure will fall below 60psi with the vacuum, so using a fuel pressure number as a dumb/ on off fail-safe wont work. While we may be able to integrate a wideband signal to activate the fail-safe at a set voltage, we still see the same issue where we can't just pick a number, due to the wideband number being suitable at decel but not at WOT. At a minimum we need a map reference as well as a wideband reference to control the fail-safe, preferably with a TPS reference to cover rapid throttle closing after a run where the fuel might cut but still have a high map value. While the fail-safe may mimic the action of lifting the throttle after a run, it is preferable to not have the vehicle enter a failure mode unnecessarily.
Preaching to the choir here but these things need to happen instantly. A flashing warning for those that are a bit slow on shutting the ignition off is something to add but not strictly necessary.
Anyhow there's a few cents
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Had an issue where it would try and stall after starting. Adjusted auF11706 to 1.8 for the whole thing and it no longer tries to stall. I also went through and logged the idle air integrator and adjusted the park/neutral values and the in gear values. They weren't out by a huge amount but getting them very close made it so much more stable coming to a stop and also changing from drive to reverse etc.
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Have you updated the tune to reflect mine and Roland's post's?
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Change auF0265 ETC Clip Torque (Requestor)/Transmission torque truncation to 1000, change auF0264 ETC Torque Reduction RPM limit (Requestor)/Transmission torque truncation to something higher than the RPM you want it to stall up to, eg: 6000.
This info is on the hp tuners forum and has been for many years.
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We literally saw that exact thing happen in this thread just a few posts up. If one of my pumps is not able to suck properly then it will show the same issue.
Timing being added to borderline table?
in Engine Tuning (AUS)
Posted
If you can hear the engine when it starts to knock then that's fine. If you do a complete tune file restructure then just sneak up on the rpm and boost so you know it has the right timing numbers and fuel etc. Don't forget the tmap settings etc for the turbo side of things.
You don't want a NA BLK table in there, it will have way too much timing in it. Use a BF turbo tune for all of your timing tables and corrections as it will already be set up for a turbo. Take the 4 degrees timing out of that to account for the NA engine and work your way back up to where it's happy. If it is knocking just take more out of it obviously. The F6 BLK map wont exactly line up with what your engine wants so some parts will need more or less taken out of it.
If the injectors are stock and you're starting at 5psi then you can just put 0.8 lambda into the lower couple of lines in the base fuel table and that will sort that part of it. You need to get the fuel in there earlier based on the TPS so you need to change that too. It is auF0523 and you can start by halving it.
This will just be a base map and will need further fine tuning. I see that you're starting with an NA Ba file, I'll attach a stock BF turbo file so you can copy tables out of it.
HACCDK3 Stock BF turbo F6 manual.tec